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	<title>Comments on: Rosie O&#8217;Donnell should look things up in Wikipedia first</title>
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	<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/</link>
	<description>Let's just see what happens</description>
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		<title>By: Cryptographrix</title>
		<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/comment-page-1/#comment-13519</link>
		<dc:creator>Cryptographrix</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 May 2007 09:53:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leahweinberger.com/johotheblog_wp/?p=3679#comment-13519</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Crosbie: Don&#039;t know if you realize this, but the story provided by the mass media fails Occam&#039;s Razor:

Assumption 1 - The impact of an object with {M) mass traveling at {N} units per {O} time + the subsequent localized fire providing {P} units of energy per {Q} time = structural failure of a steel(calculate for the rate of thermal conductivity{R1}, diffusability{S1}, Coefficient of expansion{T1}, Yield{U1}, Shear{V1}, Tensile Strength{W1}, Hardness{X1}. and Density{Y1})  and concrete(again, calculate for the rate of thermal conductivity{R2}, diffusability{S2}, Coefficient of expansion{T2}, Yield{U2}, Shear{V2}, Tensile Strength{W2}, Hardness{X2}. and Density{Y2}) architecture within Z units of time.

FYI - the values for the lowest quality of steel that I can find(in my collection) are as follows:

Steel, Carbon Type 1008
-----------------------
Melting Point: 2500degF
Brinnel Hardness: 86
Yield Strength: 24.7 ksi
Shear Strength: 11.6 ksi
Tensile Strength: 44.2 ksi
Thermal Conductivity: 139 Btu/hr-ft-F
Thermal Diffusivity: 0.37665 sq in/min
Coefficient of Expansion: 0.007 in/in-F

Please note that this is the lowest quality of steel I can find, but even with that, I doubt that anyone here will be able to give the energy provided by the mass*speed of the plane, along with the energy provided by the subsequent fire, enough energy to cause any of the WTC buildings to structurally fail.

I.e. - the sheer amount of steel, and latticework that went into the WTC buildings would have dispersed the heat of almost any fire within them quite efficiently, as almost every steel and concrete building on the planet has been known to do.
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Crosbie: Don&#8217;t know if you realize this, but the story provided by the mass media fails Occam&#8217;s Razor:</p>
<p>Assumption 1 &#8211; The impact of an object with {M) mass traveling at {N} units per {O} time + the subsequent localized fire providing {P} units of energy per {Q} time = structural failure of a steel(calculate for the rate of thermal conductivity{R1}, diffusability{S1}, Coefficient of expansion{T1}, Yield{U1}, Shear{V1}, Tensile Strength{W1}, Hardness{X1}. and Density{Y1})  and concrete(again, calculate for the rate of thermal conductivity{R2}, diffusability{S2}, Coefficient of expansion{T2}, Yield{U2}, Shear{V2}, Tensile Strength{W2}, Hardness{X2}. and Density{Y2}) architecture within Z units of time.</p>
<p>FYI &#8211; the values for the lowest quality of steel that I can find(in my collection) are as follows:</p>
<p>Steel, Carbon Type 1008<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
Melting Point: 2500degF<br />
Brinnel Hardness: 86<br />
Yield Strength: 24.7 ksi<br />
Shear Strength: 11.6 ksi<br />
Tensile Strength: 44.2 ksi<br />
Thermal Conductivity: 139 Btu/hr-ft-F<br />
Thermal Diffusivity: 0.37665 sq in/min<br />
Coefficient of Expansion: 0.007 in/in-F</p>
<p>Please note that this is the lowest quality of steel I can find, but even with that, I doubt that anyone here will be able to give the energy provided by the mass*speed of the plane, along with the energy provided by the subsequent fire, enough energy to cause any of the WTC buildings to structurally fail.</p>
<p>I.e. &#8211; the sheer amount of steel, and latticework that went into the WTC buildings would have dispersed the heat of almost any fire within them quite efficiently, as almost every steel and concrete building on the planet has been known to do.</p>
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		<title>By: srg</title>
		<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/comment-page-1/#comment-13518</link>
		<dc:creator>srg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 13:59:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leahweinberger.com/johotheblog_wp/?p=3679#comment-13518</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Rosie is not an expert on this, and so she worded her statement incorrectly.  Do you want to hear it from an expert?  Then check out Steven Jones.

Please make the time to watch these two very recent presentations.  In my mind, this is by far the most important evidence regarding 9/11.  This evidence will eventually win over the public.  However, as Jones explains in the first presentation, it takes a while for an unpopular hypothesis to gain popularity.

]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rosie is not an expert on this, and so she worded her statement incorrectly.  Do you want to hear it from an expert?  Then check out Steven Jones.</p>
<p>Please make the time to watch these two very recent presentations.  In my mind, this is by far the most important evidence regarding 9/11.  This evidence will eventually win over the public.  However, as Jones explains in the first presentation, it takes a while for an unpopular hypothesis to gain popularity.</p>
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		<title>By: http://nationalizebigoilusa.blogspot.com/</title>
		<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/comment-page-1/#comment-13517</link>
		<dc:creator>http://nationalizebigoilusa.blogspot.com/</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 12:30:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leahweinberger.com/johotheblog_wp/?p=3679#comment-13517</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[yup...wisiwig, or, what you see is what you get...

New York Times - By CHRISTOPHER MAAG
Published: May 2, 2007
KENT, Ohio, May 1 â€” An audio recording of the shootings 37 years ago at Kent State University includes the voices of Ohio National Guard leaders ordering troops to fire into a crowd of students, according to a man wounded in the shootings, who obtained a copy of the recording.

â€œThe evidence speaks for itself,â€ Mr. Canfora said. â€œThe voices are right there, very clear. There was an order to fire.â€





]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yup&#8230;wisiwig, or, what you see is what you get&#8230;</p>
<p>New York Times &#8211; By CHRISTOPHER MAAG<br />
Published: May 2, 2007<br />
KENT, Ohio, May 1 â€” An audio recording of the shootings 37 years ago at Kent State University includes the voices of Ohio National Guard leaders ordering troops to fire into a crowd of students, according to a man wounded in the shootings, who obtained a copy of the recording.</p>
<p>â€œThe evidence speaks for itself,â€ Mr. Canfora said. â€œThe voices are right there, very clear. There was an order to fire.â€</p>
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		<title>By: Crosbie Fitch</title>
		<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/comment-page-1/#comment-13516</link>
		<dc:creator>Crosbie Fitch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 09:09:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leahweinberger.com/johotheblog_wp/?p=3679#comment-13516</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Just because 99% of all 9/11 conspiracy theories fail Occam&#039;s Razor (are cuckoo) doesn&#039;t mean ther
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just because 99% of all 9/11 conspiracy theories fail Occam&#8217;s Razor (are cuckoo) doesn&#8217;t mean ther</p>
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		<title>By: Andy Weinberger</title>
		<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/comment-page-1/#comment-13515</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy Weinberger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 01:33:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leahweinberger.com/johotheblog_wp/?p=3679#comment-13515</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[We had a similar overpass collapse here in New Jersey 10-15 years ago when a fire developed under a section of Route 78 where it enters Newark.  I believe it was in an area soring garbage.  A large piece of a relatively young concrete and steel road came down.  Traffic was disrupted for months while it was repaired, but the repair actually got done sooner than planned.
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We had a similar overpass collapse here in New Jersey 10-15 years ago when a fire developed under a section of Route 78 where it enters Newark.  I believe it was in an area soring garbage.  A large piece of a relatively young concrete and steel road came down.  Traffic was disrupted for months while it was repaired, but the repair actually got done sooner than planned.</p>
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		<title>By: johne</title>
		<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/comment-page-1/#comment-13514</link>
		<dc:creator>johne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 23:19:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leahweinberger.com/johotheblog_wp/?p=3679#comment-13514</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;p&gt;This seems to bear out Noam Chomsky&#039;s point that a large number of Americans seem to believe the twin towers were brought down by a home-grown conspiracy, but take it for granted that it is little more than standard behavior for their government.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt; As a matter of fact, Wikipedia has a pretty good conspiracy theory &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11_conspiracy_theories&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;write-up&lt;/a&gt;, in addition to its &lt;a href=&quot;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;9/11 entry&lt;/a&gt;, and if you don&#039;t care for officially supported investigations or those by mainstream organizations, less conventional outfits from Skeptic Magazine (v.12 #4) to Chip Berlet, the investigator of right-wing movements, have looked into the matter with the same results.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;A point Berlet has made also seems validated: while some of us busy ourselves relearning that steel weakens before it melts, or that controlled demolition is as hard to conceal as anything else in the building trades, or that there are indeed pictures of Pentagon plane wreckage, a genuine cabal carries on a barely concealed effort to turn the United States into Peron&#039;s Argentina. &lt;/p&gt;
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This seems to bear out Noam Chomsky&#8217;s point that a large number of Americans seem to believe the twin towers were brought down by a home-grown conspiracy, but take it for granted that it is little more than standard behavior for their government.</p>
<p> As a matter of fact, Wikipedia has a pretty good conspiracy theory <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11_conspiracy_theories" rel="nofollow">write-up</a>, in addition to its <a href="" rel="nofollow">9/11 entry</a>, and if you don&#8217;t care for officially supported investigations or those by mainstream organizations, less conventional outfits from Skeptic Magazine (v.12 #4) to Chip Berlet, the investigator of right-wing movements, have looked into the matter with the same results.  </p>
<p>A point Berlet has made also seems validated: while some of us busy ourselves relearning that steel weakens before it melts, or that controlled demolition is as hard to conceal as anything else in the building trades, or that there are indeed pictures of Pentagon plane wreckage, a genuine cabal carries on a barely concealed effort to turn the United States into Peron&#8217;s Argentina. </p>
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		<title>By: Hired Hand</title>
		<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/comment-page-1/#comment-13513</link>
		<dc:creator>Hired Hand</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 22:00:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leahweinberger.com/johotheblog_wp/?p=3679#comment-13513</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[definitely not to be mean, nor argumentative, but, &quot;conspiracies&quot; aside, that is not absolute proof as to what happened. I am not saying it did not, but all the pictures I&#039;ve saved show no single sign of an airliner. just pointing that out, not arguing.
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>definitely not to be mean, nor argumentative, but, &#8220;conspiracies&#8221; aside, that is not absolute proof as to what happened. I am not saying it did not, but all the pictures I&#8217;ve saved show no single sign of an airliner. just pointing that out, not arguing.</p>
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		<title>By: David Weinberger</title>
		<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/comment-page-1/#comment-13512</link>
		<dc:creator>David Weinberger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 20:50:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leahweinberger.com/johotheblog_wp/?p=3679#comment-13512</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A friend whose name I will keep out of this but who is sober and reliable and whom I trust 100% was walking to work when he saw the passenger airliner hit the Pentagon. This was, obviously, rather traumatic. I thus reject conspiracy theories that say that that aircraft did not hit the Pentagon.
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A friend whose name I will keep out of this but who is sober and reliable and whom I trust 100% was walking to work when he saw the passenger airliner hit the Pentagon. This was, obviously, rather traumatic. I thus reject conspiracy theories that say that that aircraft did not hit the Pentagon.</p>
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		<title>By: Rainyday Cart</title>
		<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/comment-page-1/#comment-13511</link>
		<dc:creator>Rainyday Cart</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Apr 2007 22:01:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leahweinberger.com/johotheblog_wp/?p=3679#comment-13511</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve listened to the presentation on the fall of #7, and I have a million apprehensions about the officially sanctioned report, personally, if you can&#039;t beat &#039;em...
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve listened to the presentation on the fall of #7, and I have a million apprehensions about the officially sanctioned report, personally, if you can&#8217;t beat &#8216;em&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Federman</title>
		<link>http://www.hyperorg.com/blogger/2007/04/30/rosie-odonnell-should-look-things-up-in-wikipedia-first/comment-page-1/#comment-13510</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Federman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Apr 2007 21:45:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.leahweinberger.com/johotheblog_wp/?p=3679#comment-13510</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yeah, with an awful lot of as yet not well explained but-what-abouts...

But what about the burning temperature of Jet A fuel compared to the melting temperature of steel... but what about the fire at the top melting the steel tens of storeys below... but what about the relative lack of fire in Building 7... but what about the absence of smashed plane parts at the Pentagon or in the field in Pennsylvania...

The entire scenario, according to any explanation - be it the officially sanctioned version or any of the alternative versions - is implausible. But it did happen, 3000+ lives were lost on the day, thousands of families were disrupted, and the geopolitical aftermath is beyond individual human conception.

I think the true and complete story - which I would suggest will be a matter for future forensic historians - pales in comparison to the consequences and effects for us all around the world.
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, with an awful lot of as yet not well explained but-what-abouts&#8230;</p>
<p>But what about the burning temperature of Jet A fuel compared to the melting temperature of steel&#8230; but what about the fire at the top melting the steel tens of storeys below&#8230; but what about the relative lack of fire in Building 7&#8230; but what about the absence of smashed plane parts at the Pentagon or in the field in Pennsylvania&#8230;</p>
<p>The entire scenario, according to any explanation &#8211; be it the officially sanctioned version or any of the alternative versions &#8211; is implausible. But it did happen, 3000+ lives were lost on the day, thousands of families were disrupted, and the geopolitical aftermath is beyond individual human conception.</p>
<p>I think the true and complete story &#8211; which I would suggest will be a matter for future forensic historians &#8211; pales in comparison to the consequences and effects for us all around the world.</p>
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