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April 15, 2003

With Friendsters like that...

After two friends asked me to join Friendster, I finally gave in. It's a well-designed site that enables friends to explore one another's social circles and make new friends. Yet I resent it and other sites like it. I think now I know why: I don't like it when a site assumes that what's implicit can be made explicit without loss. Friendster asks me to do so twice over.

First, to jump into Friendster, I have to make explicit a social network that at its heart and at its best is implicit. There's an online social network lying unearthed in my inbox and outbox. Why do I have to reassemble it, person by person, for Friendster? And if Friendster doesn't work out, do I do it again for the next attempt? That would be a pain in the ass, but because it involves persuading my friends to sign up, it's asking others to get pains in their asses.

Then Friendster asks me to describe myself. Gender, age, occupation all are no problem. But then there are my interests, my favorite music, favorite TV shows and "about me." I don't actually have an internal list of favorite music so I can't simply make explicit what was implicit all along. I'd have to fabricate a list and do so pretty much without context. Bach? Ellington? Beck? Two measures of a Keith Jarrett improvisation that took me totally by surprise? The time I cried when listening to kd lang even though she never moved me again? The song I whistle ("Octopus' Garden") in the shower even though I don't like it?

"Making explicit" rarely means simply unearthing what's lying there unearthed. It means creating something new. That's why the best service technicians aren't necessarily the best teachers: there's no such thing as humans doing a "data dump."

I know this sounds like a rather abstract reason for not liking a well-designed site such as Friendster. But the abstraction is from a very concrete experience: facing a Web page that wants me to list my favorite friends, my favorite books, my favorite music. I can't because I don't really have an internal set of bookmarks I can simply externalize. And I wouldn't if I could.


I am well aware that in another blog entry today I refered to "Art and Illusion" as one of my favorite books. But that doesn't imply I have a list of favorites. In fact, when confronted with Friendster's demand that I list favorites, "Art and Illusion" didn't occur to me.

Posted by D. Weinberger at April 15, 2003 01:58 PM


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Listed below are links to weblogs that reference With Friendsters like that...:

» Friend or foe? from The Obvious?
I originally played around with Friendster months ago when someone at work introduced me to it. At first I thought [Read More]

Tracked on April 16, 2003 01:44 AM

» Next best thing from The Obvious?
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» wanna be my friendster? from jill/txt
A few weeks ago Liz invited me to join Friendster, which is a social networking site. You enter your profile, say whether you want to make friends, find business partners, date or all of the above, and then you hook... [Read More]

Tracked on April 28, 2003 08:42 AM

» FRinBL 5 from social networks tools
jill walker [28 April 2003] - a great academic discussion about Friendster "Ah, Friendster testimonials are clearly an artform in themselves. I misunderstood the genre at first, and wrote sensible ones - there's obviously no need for this, as you'll... [Read More]

Tracked on July 9, 2003 04:05 AM

» FRinBL 5 from social networks tools
jill walker [28 April 2003] - a great academic discussion about Friendster "Ah, Friendster testimonials are clearly an artform in themselves. I misunderstood the genre at first, and wrote sensible ones - there's obviously no need for this, as you'll... [Read More]

Tracked on July 9, 2003 04:05 AM

» Codifying Relationships from Many-to-Many
One of the problems that plagues the “YASNSes” (as Clay calls the growing number of social networking systems) is how to define or codify relationships. On the one hand, trying to make all relationships equal and bidirectional, as Friendste... [Read More]

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» Relationships are multi-valent from Curiouser and curiouser!
Granularities of relationships . [Read More]

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Comments

I've also become suspicious about what it plans to do with all of this personal, detailed demographic data with attached email addresses.

Posted by: Gary Turner | April 15, 2003 03:58 PM


Lets not confuse one's public face - from your own internal representational systems and thoughts. No one ever bent your arm to join, but when you did you inherently accept the rules of that "world". They're into flirting there and they're just trying to coax you into playing along.

At ENTCON Chris DeBoma will talk about social infratructures and Gaming, while Ryze is getting people to meet each other, though not much more than that. Each kind of identity system puts their own twist on it.

I still think we need to focus on what the activities are once people meet.

Posted by: Marc Canter | April 15, 2003 06:42 PM


Dave,

I'm with you - I've been invited into Friendster a few times now, and at first I thought it was cool - but then I got more and more uncomfortable with the things it was asking about me - my age, marital status, etc. When they asked me if I was into wife swapping, I figured that that was it - And I left the site. I won't be back. there's something too freaky about it all. The worst part of it is that most people will freely give away all that personal information just because they are asked. If friendster wants to work, they are going to have to work harder at getting my business and relationships. For now, they can suck wind.

Dave

Posted by: David Sifry | April 15, 2003 08:52 PM


I think that many introverts have trouble with this sort of public exhibitionism. We extroverts think nothing of it.

Posted by: Michael | April 15, 2003 11:37 PM


Actually, my problems with it are more nuanced:

1) How do you declare friendships that are at best awareness (Goffman's Intimate Stranger problem)? What happens when they declare you as a friend? Thus, how real are the networks?

2) Why can't i present multiple aspects of myself in a meaningful way? I'm not always any one description. That description may be valid for dating, but more than potential dates are on Friendster.

3) I'm sad that there's not more effort to do something beyond a dating site...

Posted by: zephoria | April 16, 2003 01:40 PM


Nice points, zephoria. Thanks. (The rest of you made nice points, too. I love you all!)

Posted by: David Weinberger | April 16, 2003 03:00 PM


"I don't like it when a site assumes that what's implicit can be made explicit without loss. Friendster asks me to do so twice over."

Amen.

Perhaps I like to fly under the radar, preferring to lose as little as possible of the richness of that which is implicit, tacit, or nuanced in a loud, brash world. I don't know to what degree introversion and extraversion come into it. I suspect they do but my introversion doesn't worry me. I believe I'm attracted to that which is implicit because it keeps me guessing while that which has been laid bare holds little or no appeal. Following zephoria's point, if there's no attempt by Friendster to expand on the possibilities of what we have now, I certainly have no interest in adding material of swiftly decreasing value to mundane certainties (rather than imperatives). It costs too much.

Posted by: Mike Golby | April 16, 2003 05:42 PM


There's nothing to stop you crafting alternative personae on Friendster. My bizarrely crowded 3 degrees friendship cloud includes such people as 'Jack Daniels' 'Burning Man' 'Batboy' 'Your Boss' and many others who seem partly fictiitous, if not wholly pseudonymous. Multiply yourself, zephoria.

Posted by: Kevin Marks | April 16, 2003 06:47 PM


So what are you saying? We're not friends? Add me to your list. I promise I write the best testimonials... ;)

Posted by: Alex | April 18, 2003 12:50 AM


Touche, Alex.

And, btw, I'm rejecting all testimonials. It's bad enough that to participate we have to list our friends (and thus imply a not-friends list). But writing testimonials to each other??? Gag me with an explicit spoon!

Posted by: dweinberger | April 18, 2003 09:34 AM


I totally get the testimonials. Reading nice words other people have written about you feels nice. And in composite, they sketch out a little something about who the testimonialized person is. Even when they're silly. Someone smarter than me, I forget who, once said "there is nothing so dear to another person's ear than the sound of their own name being uttered."

Friendster testimonials are sort of like that. Ear candy for navel-gazers. And most of us are navel-gazers, whether we'll admit it in public or not.

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