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May 16, 2004

Permission-Free Prison

Fascinating article by Seymour "Next Pulitzer a-Comin'" Hersh in this week's New Yorker. It alleges that the abuses at Abu Ghraib happened because a "special-access program" established by Rumsfeld to authorize quick-response kill/capture/interrogate operations took hold there. Hersh does not allege that Rumsfeld knew of or authorized the particular abuses, only that his program of secret, rough interrogation enabled them.

But it's a far more nuanced article than I'm letting on. And, of course, it's well-told.

Posted by D. Weinberger at May 16, 2004 08:13 AM


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» What really happened at Abu Ghraib? III from DRS's Radley weblog
Yet another key article by Seymour Hersh in The New Yorker. Here follows a summary of some of the key parts, but the whole article should be read — it is, as David Weinberger points out, carefully nuanced. The roots of the Abu Ghraib prison scandal l... [Read More]

Tracked on May 16, 2004 09:03 AM

Comments

Hm.

"“We’re giving the world a ready-made excuse to ignore the Geneva Conventions. Rumsfeld has lowered the bar.”"

I had wondered if "BeatWay" saw the "headline" yesterday: An article oddly not titled al Zarqiwi and al Sadr apprarently say 'Take no Prisoners' to most everyone on the planet?

“This is the last policeman that we will free. Any new policemen we capture will be executed for collaborating with the occupiers,” Tai told reporters."

"Sadr's militiamen raided a police station Friday and escaped with a cache of assault rifles, police said earlier.

I waiting for the loud outcrys to fire this man Tai, as you'll observe the Coalition Forces trying to impeach al Sadr the only way possible (contrary to the edicts of some of the wiser folk in Iraq), whilst they were attempting to server a murder warrant on him, btw.

Posted by: JayT | May 16, 2004 03:27 PM


I would also admit myself to being something of a freetard. What does Mr. Seymour's title refer to?? Is he a Seer in this regard then?? (As I'm so freetarded, that I haven't read enough of Mr. Seymour, for one thing.)

:

(I wuz standing a local restaurant, holding open door (as I was a doorman, in a present life...;-), and he said "Dag! There I am standing like a freetard!!"...;-)

Posted by: JayT | May 16, 2004 03:47 PM


Sorry, back on topic:

"Retired Maj. Gen. Mohammed Abdul-Latif rose to prominence after nearly monthlong battles last month between the Marines monthlong battles in April between the Marines and insurgents hunkered down in Fallujah's neighborhoods."

I haven't read this yet, but will say this is a man of profound bravery, as is Mr. Pervez Musharraf. Both of whom both Bennett and Powers degrade and demean, I might observe, as the fact they're very lives are in danger all the time..

..well, this is not the full measure of their bravery, in the least, in my view of the facts I perceive/happen-across.

Posted by: JayT | May 16, 2004 04:29 PM


As I "predicted"...

Mr. Latif has obviously observed, first-hand, the reason the Americans unfortunately tortured and buried some thousands young Iraq men, on the way to Baghdad... However, most young Iraq men and women survived this first year of Iraqi Democracy, nonetheless, thus far. Of this there is some no small-thanks to go around.

There was, and still is, a reason "we" (Real Warriors more than those that actually support them) are in Iraq. Tho some would block out this reality, for the oddest non-reasons.

Posted by: JayT | May 16, 2004 04:55 PM


"Free"...)-;

When I said "more than those that actually support them", I do not include Iraqi's themselves, who are (unfortunately-and-necessarily) the largest part of the Real Warriors I've heard of.

Posted by: JayT | May 16, 2004 04:57 PM


one if by land, two if by sea...jt is coming, jt is coming. now, where's that gorgeous naked babe on horseback when you need her most?!

Posted by: bw | May 16, 2004 07:36 PM


What?

This is the first I've heard of any naked babes coming.. on horseback, or even cars??

I should, perhaps, not be so sanguine about my chances...;-)-;

Posted by: JayT | May 16, 2004 07:53 PM


David, would it be possible to have a comment thread here as opposed to a troll fest. JayT, have you considered getting a blog of your own?

Posted by: Enough of JayT | May 16, 2004 08:40 PM


Btw, I'm still looking for clarification/x/answers to a few questions, like what Mr. Seymour's title is illuding to and did it have anything to do with Mr. McCain's comments on the matter?

Or whoknowswho'hoknowshoo... in a word.

Btw, I gotta hunch C-Lo (please tell me that's not the gorgeous naked babes a-comin'.. please...;-) knows some-a-witch is goin' down, but he won't cut the comedy long enough to tell me.

Posted by: JayT | May 16, 2004 08:47 PM


Thank you for the troll, Troll-T...!!

How say you, David?? Can I get a blog of my very own?!? (Seems improbable, to me, but mebbe thaz jes me...)-;

Posted by: JayT | May 16, 2004 08:49 PM


Can you get a blog of your own? Why not? Blogger.com just did a major upgrade as die www.movabletype.org. If you need a hand getting started, let me know offline.

Posted by: David Weinberger | May 17, 2004 10:28 AM


There are other reasons, other than technical, for my not having a blog, David.

But thanks for offer...

I'm still not clear about Mr. Hersh's article. (And apologize when I said Mr. Seymour above, as I'm bad with names.)

Is Mr. Hersh suggesting that HE's in line for a Pulitzer, with his own writings?? I didn't take it that he was saying such-an arrogant thing, but am not clear what he was intending...

No help on this question from Mr. Locke, or anyOne else?

Posted by: JayT | May 17, 2004 11:02 AM


Arrrrrrrrgh... (sic) meant: "in addition to technical"...

Posted by: JayT | May 17, 2004 11:03 AM


JayT, you should get your own blog because you're posting too much to mine.

The fake nickname I gave Hersh was my way of humorously suggesting that this series is going to get him his next Pulitzer.

Posted by: David Weinberger | May 17, 2004 11:48 AM


Okay, David... I take it that it's my pov which is too much, more than the quantity of posts. And I take that to be a fact, rather than my own personal opinion.

I will primarily post elsewhere (although almost certainly NOT to my own blog). But I still do not see what Mr. Hersh was illuding to, in his title.

I'll lurk, in case anyOne finds out some-a the truths of these matters...

Did you ever figure out why I was posting so much here, David?? (Of course, that would be an attempt to continue the discussion, and my posting here, so I don't expect a reply.)-;

Posted by: JayT | May 17, 2004 12:38 PM


Brave 1st Lt. Mark V. Shaney USMC, wounded but keeps fighting on!

"Mortars, machine guns, rocket propelled grenades. And the kid out of Churchville was done 1st Lt. Mark V. Shaney was out ammo. Then he fought with its mortars and riflemen, machineguns and grenadiers. And he fought with the 52th Mountain Division's Charlie Company took cover in shallow ditches and rises and began returning fire in both directions. To move faster, many dropped their 72- pound rucksacks stuffed with food, cold-weather gear, and tried to poke a hole through the Iraqi line his humvee came under direct enemy machine gun emplacement that was attacking his Marines. Over into the humvee directly into the face of heavy enemy fire, and kind of said, 'Oh hell, if I'm not dying."

Posted by: Ray Onar | August 5, 2004 02:09 PM


were do i go to unblock myspace

Posted by: rks | June 12, 2006 05:37 PM


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